considering buying into the vintage Fiat Spider world

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MrBlimp
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Joined: Thu Jun 15, 2017 12:03 am
Your car is a: 1978 Fiat 124 Spider
Location: Chichester, NY

considering buying into the vintage Fiat Spider world

Postby MrBlimp » Fri Jun 16, 2017 6:14 pm

So, what do I need to know - what is the reason behind the Fix It Again Tony moniker this car has earned itself?
69 Triumph Spitfire
70 MGB
78 Fiat 124 Spider
92 Mustang LX
00 Jeep Wrangler Sport 4.0L - Totaled
00 Ford Ranger XLT 3.0L
05 Hyundai Accent

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joelittel
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Your car is a: 1980 Spider 2000 FI
Location: Evanston, IL

Re: considering buying into the vintage Fiat Spider world

Postby joelittel » Fri Jun 16, 2017 7:55 pm

You'll find lots of theories as to why FIAT got a bad reputation. Everything from US mechanics not having metric tools to the importer not telling dealers that the timing belts needed to be changed, etc etc.

I think the truth is simply that like any good nickname Fix It Again Tony simply stuck.

All cars of this vintage have their problems, think about how many towing companies were around 30 years ago... and having car troubles was a legitimate excuse for being late to anything.

A refurbished stock spider is, in my opinion, a very reliable and fun car. The joy and simultaneous grief of it is the refurbishment process.

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MrBlimp
Posts: 88
Joined: Thu Jun 15, 2017 12:03 am
Your car is a: 1978 Fiat 124 Spider
Location: Chichester, NY

Re: considering buying into the vintage Fiat Spider world

Postby MrBlimp » Fri Jun 16, 2017 9:39 pm

joelittel wrote:A refurbished stock spider is, in my opinion, a very reliable and fun car. The joy and simultaneous grief of it is the refurbishment process.


Owning a couple of British Lucas cars I understand, though I am a patina car owner, my cars are not refurbished, they completely show their age.
69 Triumph Spitfire
70 MGB
78 Fiat 124 Spider
92 Mustang LX
00 Jeep Wrangler Sport 4.0L - Totaled
00 Ford Ranger XLT 3.0L
05 Hyundai Accent

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joelittel
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Your car is a: 1980 Spider 2000 FI
Location: Evanston, IL

Re: considering buying into the vintage Fiat Spider world

Postby joelittel » Fri Jun 16, 2017 10:53 pm

By refurbished I meant made to operate safely by replacing all the perishables.

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nelsonj
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Your car is a: 1972 Spider 124

Re: considering buying into the vintage Fiat Spider world

Postby nelsonj » Sat Jun 17, 2017 2:17 am

What do you need to know....post 1980 the cars are 2.0L fuel injected, earlier cars are carbed and have engines from 1450ish to 1756 (aka 1800). Their is no "right" answer, but you'll need to decide what route you want to take. Besides the hoods, bumpers, lights and door handles, the bodies are basically exactly the same from late 1960's to the early 1980's.

Mechanically, you must have everything related to the timing belt kept in top/good shape, including all the cam gears and seals as well as the belt itself. Below 2.0L are all interference engines, and even the 2.0L have issues, and a slipped or broken timing belt will at best result in 8 bent valves.

The "donut" that connects the driveshaft to the transmission is rubber and it cracks with (years) or age. Make sure you replace it if it has some years on it or the drive shaft can drop while driving. Not good.

Some people warn that the ball joints on the suspension can fail and create serious problems, but I don't hear too many people talking about this.

Make sure you put the thermostat (external) in properly or you'll overheat the engine. It's easy to put in backwards if you don't know what you're doing.

These are the "must knows" - if you mind these you should be in good shape. They are very fun cars to drive, and I enjoy fixing things as they break. Parts are readily available via mail-order, and there are lots of ways to upgrade the performance. I find parts very affordable compared to just about any other vintage car. At this stage, most view these as hobbies, but some still rely on them as transportation.

Lots of knowledge on this board. I highly recommend you post questions here before deciding to buy anything.

Good luck and hope to hear from you.


Oh - and one more thing. And while I've never driven the similar British cars, 9 out of 10 FIAT drivers will tell you the FIAT is a lot more fun to drive. And NO LUCAS ELECTRONICS. :)

Peace.
Out.
Last edited by nelsonj on Sat Jun 17, 2017 2:22 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Simi Valley, California
Spider 1800
Romans 10:9

Jimb
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Your car is a: 1985.5 Volumex

Re: considering buying into the vintage Fiat Spider world

Postby Jimb » Sat Jun 17, 2017 2:22 am

FORD....Figure On Repairs Daily.

Jim

mscafide
Posts: 330
Joined: Fri Jan 23, 2009 6:59 pm
Your car is a: 1974 124 Spider
Location: Pompano Beach, Florida

Re: considering buying into the vintage Fiat Spider world

Postby mscafide » Sat Jun 17, 2017 8:55 am

British cars got much of the same crap, maybe some of it earned.
All add to the charm.

If it's not leaking you're out of fluids.

Don't go out at night - Lucas

Lucas - Prince of darkness.
1974 124 Spider
1964 500 D
2012 500 Sport
1948 Ford 8N tractor (restored (don't drink and ebay))

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lglade
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Your car is a: 1984 Pininfarina
Location: Mukilteo, WA

Re: considering buying into the vintage Fiat Spider world

Postby lglade » Sat Jun 17, 2017 9:18 am

My 1984 Spider is of very similar to quality to other European cars of that era. It's easy to work on and reliable. I'd hate to pay a mechanic to keep any 33-year old car in fine running order, but with a manual and some basic shop tools you can do it yourself pretty easily. Spare parts are readily available and inexpensive, too, which is a big plus for anyone dabbling with old cars.
Lloyd Glade- Mukilteo, WA
1984 Pininfarina Spider Azzurra
1962 Fiat 500D - wife's car
2015 Subaru Outback
2017 Ford Focus RS

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chrisg
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Joined: Sun Jun 04, 2006 7:30 am
Your car is a: 1971 FIAT

Re: considering buying into the vintage Fiat Spider world

Postby chrisg » Sat Jun 17, 2017 9:48 am

They were widely misunderstood cars. In the 90s when it seemed I was acquiring them in bulk in a wide array of levels of maintenance, there were many common themes of hacks (some could be called sabotage) I/we found by previous owners or "mechanics"....add the typical lack of rust proofing on thin metal (vs very thick metal on American cars at the time). Add to that a dealer support network that apparently was based on the philosophy of "you bought the car, OK, well F you now" (to customers & to dealers trying to support their customers) until the pull out in 1983 and you can imagine the cars getting a bad rap. Why British cars that probably sucked equally remained sexy sports cars and Italian cars were treated with disdain, I don't know. On the flip side, I've always been fine with that because it weeded out people who are into the cars for some sort of status BS or "investment" and made them affordable for a workin' man like me to buy (and ultimately buy probably the better part of a hundred of). The gem to me is the basic car with a bit of knowledge & caring maintenance gives you a wonderful driving experience that is so far out of proportion to what you probably expect. And I say that with the thought that the 124 Spider is probably the least rewarding/handling of the whole family of 60s-80s Fiats, but still far better than you should expect! (And before anyone wants to argue, I mean without the usual recommended handling & volumetric efficiency improvements)
Chris Granju
Knoxville, TN
'71 FIAT 124BS (pretty), '72 FIAT 124BC,'76 FIAT 128 Wagon(ratbeast), '85 Bertone X 1/9, '70 124BC (project), 79 X1/9 (hot rod in rehab), '73 124BS (2L, mean), '74 124 Special TC, '73 124CS, '73 124 Familiare

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chrisg
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Your car is a: 1971 FIAT

Re: considering buying into the vintage Fiat Spider world

Postby chrisg » Sat Jun 17, 2017 9:53 am

Wait, do you mean a 124 Spider or an 850 Spider?
Chris Granju
Knoxville, TN
'71 FIAT 124BS (pretty), '72 FIAT 124BC,'76 FIAT 128 Wagon(ratbeast), '85 Bertone X 1/9, '70 124BC (project), 79 X1/9 (hot rod in rehab), '73 124BS (2L, mean), '74 124 Special TC, '73 124CS, '73 124 Familiare

baltobernie
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Your car is a: 1973 Spider [sold]
Location: Baltimore, MD

Re: considering buying into the vintage Fiat Spider world

Postby baltobernie » Sat Jun 17, 2017 10:36 am

Now, it's "Fix It Again Tokyo".

All good points in previous posts. For more pointers on pre-purchase inpection:
http://www.mirafiori.com/faq/content/buyspid.html
http://www.hemmings.com/hsx/stories/2006/08/01/hmn_buyers_guide1.html

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MrBlimp
Posts: 88
Joined: Thu Jun 15, 2017 12:03 am
Your car is a: 1978 Fiat 124 Spider
Location: Chichester, NY

Re: considering buying into the vintage Fiat Spider world

Postby MrBlimp » Sat Jun 17, 2017 6:41 pm

Ok, I bought it, and the trailer load of parts that came with it. Now I just have to get it and the parts home.

Items noted:
-Wipers not working, but then again I have no idea what all those switches on the dash are actually for.
- Drive's front signals hanging (bulbs and sockets)
- The seats are from some other car and are too thick in the seat cushion, so the driver sits too high (original seats will need to be recovered)
- Car ran very rough - I assume it needs a tune up (plugs/points)
- Car has the smell of moth balls currently being used to deter mice, etc... (I have to get them all out and replace them with bars of Irish Spring soap - FAST, only, I probably can't go back there for 2 weeks)

Trailer of parts:
- block, heads, and other engine parts
- trani
- set of wheels
- 2 sets of convertible top rails
- Anzi exhaust
- drive shaft
- radiator, shroud, electric fan
- door cards
- original air filter
- hood and trunk lid
- 4 milk boxes of misc parts
- rocker trim
- exterior trim
- fiberglass hardtop
- 2 shop manuals
- full engine gasket kit
- 4 hub caps
- set of wheel spacers
- set of rubber bumpers
- door seals

There might be more but that's most of it - I will have to go through those 4 milk crates to see what is in them - at least one had extra signal lights and what looked like some chassis struts repair pieces
69 Triumph Spitfire
70 MGB
78 Fiat 124 Spider
92 Mustang LX
00 Jeep Wrangler Sport 4.0L - Totaled
00 Ford Ranger XLT 3.0L
05 Hyundai Accent

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chrisg
Posts: 746
Joined: Sun Jun 04, 2006 7:30 am
Your car is a: 1971 FIAT

Re: considering buying into the vintage Fiat Spider world

Postby chrisg » Sat Jun 17, 2017 9:57 pm

What kind of fiberglass hard top?
Chris Granju
Knoxville, TN
'71 FIAT 124BS (pretty), '72 FIAT 124BC,'76 FIAT 128 Wagon(ratbeast), '85 Bertone X 1/9, '70 124BC (project), 79 X1/9 (hot rod in rehab), '73 124BS (2L, mean), '74 124 Special TC, '73 124CS, '73 124 Familiare

PhillySpider
Posts: 325
Joined: Tue Apr 26, 2016 6:51 pm
Your car is a: 1980 Spider 2000
Location: New Hope, PA

Re: considering buying into the vintage Fiat Spider world

Postby PhillySpider » Sun Jun 18, 2017 9:35 am

Jimb wrote:FORD....Figure On Repairs Daily.

Jim


Found On Road, Dead
Fixed Or Repaired Daily

As for fix it again tony, FIAT's were shipped on open air containers and the undercarriages were not rinsed down. This caused corrosions of the mechanicals and electricals. FIAT dealers then started undercoating, still without first washing off, which caused FASTER corrosion. By the time they began doing it right (around 1980) the stigma stuck. As others said, a small dealer network, with little training and the wrong tools certainly didn't help the brand.
I'd argue a well sorted spider is as reliable and more fun than any MGB, Triumph, Ghia or the like. YMMV.

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MrBlimp
Posts: 88
Joined: Thu Jun 15, 2017 12:03 am
Your car is a: 1978 Fiat 124 Spider
Location: Chichester, NY

Re: considering buying into the vintage Fiat Spider world

Postby MrBlimp » Sun Jun 18, 2017 10:35 am

PhillySpider wrote: I'd argue a well sorted spider is as reliable and more fun than any MGB, Triumph, Ghia or the like. YMMV.

As the owner of both a 69 Triumph Spitfire and 70 MGB (though clearly older then the 78 Fiat I just bought), I'll let you know my opinion of the Fiat in comparison, once I get it home, sorted out, and inspected.

Number 1 and 2 items I need to sort out are:
1. Tune up to eliminate the roughness
2. All the electrics - though, as I don't have an owner's manual, I don't know what any of the dash switches are actually supposed to do
69 Triumph Spitfire
70 MGB
78 Fiat 124 Spider
92 Mustang LX
00 Jeep Wrangler Sport 4.0L - Totaled
00 Ford Ranger XLT 3.0L
05 Hyundai Accent


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